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Majial

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PostSubject: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 4:17 am

Taxes , Do we keep the current rate? or Do we revert back to 5% ? or Do we find a happy medium somewhere in between?

We were ensured the tax issue would be revisited upon the next congress (which is now this congress)
so lets address this sh*t !

I would like to reduce taxes by at least 2% (to 8%) so we can revive the WAMers , I literally only work myself to keep my food stores up , so i have no personal investment in lowering taxes (before i'm slammed as an elitist with a need for lower taxes and world domination) , I just really believe we need to readjust the tax rate.
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Exalted Druid

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 4:48 am

Moved to open door congress from public gallery.

Can someone show us the math proving that 8% makes a profit and 10% does not?

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Xichael

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 5:48 am

I do notice a revenue drop compared to what it should be. Perhaps we could see if 8% is healthier than 10%. However, I will say the tax increase has done wonders for the treasury.

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ErickLeRouge

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 6:07 am

Let see some numbers. I pay over 300$ in taxes work, a day. I am not rich but I will survive. I vote for it I will live with it, for the effort. If it can be lower a bit I would be pleased
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Chochi



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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 6:46 am

Alright, I threw this together: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1tgLBdW8x64XoQi4X7mvvUKQD9jj7ggxQywsaOVW4CDQ/edit?usp=sharing

If it's not clear enough, you put in the prices and other input on the left and on the right you can see how much money someone can make WAMing based on those circumstances, accounting for both VAT and WT. Does someone want to take a look through and see if my math was right?

I was also thinking of adding a way to comparing different scenarios, probably just one. So what it would look like if we lowered the WT, for example, or if we were wiped, or comparing us with a large country, etc.

Are there any other ideas that you guys would like to see?
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Foxfire

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 7:13 am

The tax is high enough that I do notice it, but it's not causing me to lose profits as of yet. If the additional funds are supporting the war efforts (which was the case made in the original argument to raise the taxes), then I think the raised taxes could be kept around for another four weeks.

As an addendum, I would like to see the import taxes raised slightly. One, it would give us slightly more revenue, as modest tax does not dissuade sellers from diversifying their selling market. Two, it would equalize out the prices from foreign sellers who are producing on multis/"slave pits" and undercutting the market. Three, with the freedom to cross borders, there is no way that prices will spike and any decrease in loyal demand would increase supply, thereby decreasing price.

If we are looking for more revenue, let's get it from the import tax while supporting local producers at the same time.
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Muglack



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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 7:31 am

1) There's no profit in import tax. We can "fine tune" it as much as we want, but there's never gonna be a windfall by finding the "sweet spot" with it.

2) There's a training war with Ireland coming. When there's a war Tax Revenue tends to spike due to increase in tank and food sales. I say we don't touch the Treasury for ANY REASON between now and that training war ending, then we cut the tax rate to either 7/8% or all the way back to 5%. By the time this event is over, we should have in excess of 250,000 CAD which is more than enough to hold the line if someone jumps us unexpectedly.
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crisfire

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 8:47 pm

If we are not in a "real war" im not sure we should be collecting tax anyway once we have a certain amount collected for a offensive or defensive war. If war comes we can always raise it before we spend the nest egg.

Im for 1% across the board during peace time, including training wars. Let people keep more of their own money and make eCanada a more attractive place to come to to live and do business
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Mann551

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 8:50 pm

If it were 1% across the board, how will we be able to afford even our own MPP's? Also, that doesn't allow us to save up money as a reserve fund except for maybe a day before the war. 10-15k is not enough by any means to win a war. We need something higher than 1% to stay afloat, or another way of earning money.

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crisfire

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 8:58 pm

Once a reserve fund is met or "nest egg" as i put it the tax can be lowered to 1%

We could budget quarterly instead of monthly so that the nest egg or "reserve fund" includes that quarters MPP's.

Or once we have a nest egg lower the tax to the sweet spot to cover the MPP's
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Mann551

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 8:59 pm

Should we decide to do that, then the question is what is the amount for a nice "nest egg" or reserve fund?


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Xichael

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 10:13 pm

crisfire wrote:
Once a reserve fund is met or "nest egg" as i put it the tax can be lowered to 1%

We could budget quarterly instead of monthly so that the nest egg or "reserve fund" includes that quarters MPP's.

Or once we have a nest egg lower the tax to the sweet spot to cover the MPP's

I am in favour of having a nest egg goal and then lowering taxes, but I think 4%-5% if more reasonable. When we need to build up the nest egg, we should be at about 8%. As Mann points out, 1% does not pay for MPP's so we would be dipping into the nest egg to cover those and would then have to raise taxes again. We should have a stable peacetime rate that is enough to cover MPP's once we have a nest egg in place.

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Majial

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Tue Jul 28, 2015 10:42 pm

We should definitely be at a rate between 5 and 8 % at the moment if we want to be fighting anytime soon but imo 10% will continue to be problematic in the eyes of the public and the people who WAM to be self sufficient.
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Chochi



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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Wed Jul 29, 2015 4:16 am

$300k banked is probably good. I'd like to see it spread out between some trusted individuals so we're not stuck if someone's unavailable.

I say we take the Work Tax down to 8% for the 1st of the month and revisit it around the 15th.


I've also doubled up my GDoc so you can now compare two different tax rates, if you'd like: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1tgLBdW8x64XoQi4X7mvvUKQD9jj7ggxQywsaOVW4CDQ/edit?usp=sharing
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Muglack



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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Wed Jul 29, 2015 8:35 am

Turns out that with what's socked away in CMoF that I didn't know about, and what we've got in the Treasury, we've got a little less than 270k CAD currently and should have 300k by Friday.

I think that we should decide on what a fair peace time tax rate should be so that it can be proposed in conjunction with the next 100k transfer to the CMoF.
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Majial

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Wed Jul 29, 2015 8:42 am

I think Peace time should be somewhere between 3 and 5 % but i assume since we are preparing for training wars and beyond we need to be between 5 and 8 % right now
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Mann551

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Wed Jul 29, 2015 5:29 pm

I think a good peace time tax would be 4-5% in and abouts.

But also, we've been told a real war is coming after the training war is over, so are we really going to play with taxes and lower them to peacetime just before we actually head off to a real war?

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Chochi



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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Thu Jul 30, 2015 12:25 am

Does the CMoF have an offer up on the monetary market? Actually, do we know if any other orgs have cash or even what those orgs are to check ourselves? And has anyone heard from the Comptroller?

If we do already have that much cash then I say we go back down to 5% and see how much that translates into now.
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Muglack



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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Thu Jul 30, 2015 3:42 am

There's no CMoF offer on the monetary market.

I don't know if there's anything in other orgs.

I don't know who has access to CMoF (last I heard it was Xichael, DMV and Aries Prime).

If Brian doesn't have CMoF access, I would assume that means he is no longer Comptroller, since that org should belong to whoever holds that position and they should be the only person with access to it.

There are all things that need to be rectified as soon as possible if anyone in the Executive thinks we're gonna start handing out cash for some secret plan that they can't be bothered to inform us about.
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Exalted Druid

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Thu Jul 30, 2015 8:38 am

This is where the secret plan was posted in closed door congress.  The budget was at least minus a 1/2 million cc last term so we had nothing to begin with.  DMV and Rylde spent 10 times with their own money then what the government did.

Edit: Link removed so you will have to look in CDC as my link title gives away the target.


Last edited by Exalted Druid on Thu Jul 30, 2015 8:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Muglack



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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Thu Jul 30, 2015 9:07 am

My understanding is that that plan is on hold, and things have changed to a new target but like I said, we're mushrooms over here. They feed us EPIC and keep us in the dark.
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Exalted Druid

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Thu Jul 30, 2015 9:32 am

The target is always fluid with the way the map changes but the premise remains the same.
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DMV3
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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Thu Jul 30, 2015 9:57 am

There will be another war in our near future. I would ask that we not tinker with taxes anytime soon.
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Exalted Druid

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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Thu Jul 30, 2015 8:26 pm

I removed my earlier link because the title was to revealing.
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Chochi



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PostSubject: Re: Lets address the elephant in the room.   Fri Jul 31, 2015 1:33 am

So how much are you expecting this war to cost and are you planning to tap into what we all now seem to be referring to as our nest egg?

Quite frankly, I'm a little concerned about our lack of accounting. I'd like us to get on top of our finances before moving any more out of the Treasury.
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